The Between the Stakes Podcast

Leadership in surveying does not begin when someone receives a title. It begins when they start taking responsibility for people, decisions, and outcomes.

In this episode of Between the Stakes, Stewart, Stacey and Nolan discuss how young professionals can move from field and technical positions into crew leadership, project management, business ownership and executive roles. They compare trial-by-fire leadership development with intentional mentorship, explore the different opportunities available in small and large firms and discuss why aspiring leaders must speak up about their goals, ask questions, seek out mentors and be willing to learn from mistakes.

Stewart also shares his journey from survey technician to owner of Dioptra, including the company’s succession plan, the realities of valuing a surveying business, and how he structured the purchase from the previous owner. The group considers what firm owners should do now to identify, train, and prepare the people who may eventually succeed them.

In part two of the conversation with Peta Cox, the focus shifts from recognizing workplace bias to confronting it through practical leadership, mentoring, and allyship.
Nolan introduces real-world situations he has encountered as a mentor and business owner, beginning with the challenges facing a pregnant field professional working in demanding conditions. The group discusses the responsibility of employers to listen, understand what an employee needs, explore reasonable changes to duties or schedules, and create a plan that supports both the person and the business.
The discussion expands into what meaningful allyship looks like in everyday situations. That includes letting people finish speaking, returning credit to the person whose idea was overlooked, challenging inappropriate behavior on job sites, asking for advice when unsure, and speaking up rather than privately recognizing that something was wrong after the moment has passed.
Peta and Stacey also explain why organizations such as WISE and the Women Surveyors Summit are not intended to divide the profession. They provide safe environments where women can discuss experiences that male colleagues may never have faced or may not know how to address. These networks offer professional development, community, mentoring, and reassurance that many others often share individual struggles.
The conversation ultimately broadens into leadership, employee development, loyalty, and retention. The group argues that companies must live up to the values written in their policies, invest in employees even when those employees may eventually leave, and recognize that people often move on because they do not feel seen, heard, supported, or given room to grow.
The central takeaway is direct: awareness is not enough. Leaders and colleagues must listen, educate themselves, challenge biased behavior, support professional growth, and use their voices to help break the cycle.

Australian surveyor, educator, writer, and WISE Network founder Peta Cox joins the Between the Stakes crew for a candid discussion about the realities women encounter in the surveying profession.

Drawing on more than three decades across the public sector, private practice, and education, Peta explains why she created the WISE Network: to connect women who are often the only female surveyor in their workplace and give them a safe place to share experiences, seek advice, and realize they are not facing these challenges alone.

The conversation then explores the experiences behind Peta’s article on the profession’s “unspoken bias.” Peta describes being dismissed as a young single mother, having her knowledge overlooked, seeing women treated as token appointments, and watching employers fail to support female staff when problems arise on construction sites. Stacey offers the perspective of a younger professional who has seen progress but still encounters subtler forms of being interrupted, ignored, or having her ideas repeated by someone else.

The group also examines generational change, the continuing influence of the “old boys’ club,” performative diversity policies, and the danger of promoting women without the mentoring or support needed to succeed. The episode closes with practical first steps for women experiencing these issues: find a trusted network, seek out a mentor, communicate openly with leadership, and recognize when a company’s culture may be the wrong fit.

During a podcast recording session, hosts Stewart Ward, Stacey Pollock, and Nolan Mark catch up on technical adjustments and recent personal milestones before diving into Nolan’s trip to Cape Town, South Africa, for the International Federation of Surveyors (FIG) conference. Nolan shares his travel highlights, including his culinary adventures with exotic meats like impala and ostrich, sightseeing excursions to see South African penguins and a safari, and the conference's multi-round leadership voting process that designated upcoming event locations through 2030.

Transitioning into industry topics, Nolan sparks a debate on the efficacy of one-man field crews; the group collectively concludes that while single-person crews offer cost efficiency for simple layouts, two-man crews must remain the standard to ensure safety, minimize missed field evidence, and provide crucial mentorship for newly licensed professionals.

Looking ahead, the trio wraps up by planning a future episode focused on the often-overlooked business management and leadership aspects of land surveying.

During a podcast recording session, hosts Stacey, Stewart, and Nolan discuss remote-work technical setups and podcast intro formatting before diving into an extended discussion on Stewart's hobby of amateur beekeeping and its distinct parallels to the surveying profession. Stewart describes the highly structured, collective lifecycle of a honeybee hive, illustrating how bees instinctively transition roles as they age, construct hives with absolute geometric precision, and utilize landmark navigation to "beeline" back home—traits the group compares to structural firm mentorship, CAD precision, and field site calibrations.

Transitioning to the episode's industry hot take, Stacey argues that 100% remote work is highly detrimental to the professional development of young surveyors, as it eliminates the instantaneous face-to-face communication and spontaneous mentorship critical for passing licensure exams. While acknowledging that remote work suits stationary production technicians or helps mitigate long commutes, the hosts ultimately agree that physical office presence is a necessary career sacrifice for aspiring professionals, concluding the episode with a teaser from Nolan regarding the drawbacks of one-man field crews.

Meet Stewart Ward, PLS!

Stewart is a grounded, disciplined, and highly structured individual. He is a self-proclaimed early riser who hits the gym at 5:00 AM five days a week, a routine he maintains even while traveling for conferences. While friendly and deeply connected to his younger peers, he is fiercely protective of his schedule (joking about his 8:30 PM bedtime) and values control. His structured mindset carries over into diverse personal interests; he runs a specialized farm raising beef, manages composting worms, and is an amateur beekeeper fascinated by the strict organization and societal structure of bees.

Meet Nolan Mark, PS!

Nolan is highly driven, competitive, and brings an athletic, sports-centric mindset to his business operations. A former Division III college baseball pitcher and shortstop, he channels that same intense focus, work ethic, and "geek" level of passion directly into surveying. He admits to having heavy OCD, which shows in his frustration with disorganized gym weights and his desire to build a private three-bay garage gym to maintain total control over his environment. While he describes himself as having an underlying introverted side, he is highly expressive, opinionated, and fiercely dedicated to his family, spending his free time coaching or keeping up with his two highly energetic young boys in youth sports.

Meet Stacey Pollock, PLS!

Stacey is vibrant, highly organized, and proudly embraces her identity as a woman in a historically male-dominated industry—evident in her choice of custom hot-pink survey caps. She is incredibly driven, often joking about her packed schedule. She has a deep love for legal and historical research, which she connects to an early childhood fascination with maps. Outside of work, she is highly active, participating in recreational leagues for soccer and archery. She also horseback rides and cares for her Mastiff mix "fur baby.”